Shelbyville on Oprah

[Randy]

Oprah just did an expose' in Shelbyville, IN. (Don't focus on the fact that I was watching Oprah, focus on the next fact.)

She says that Shelbyville has a 1 in 3 dropout rate in High Schools. She also says that High Schools all over IN are being called "drop out factories."

Anyone have info, opinions, or stories to share about this?

[agingdiva]

Anyone have info, opinions, or stories to share about this?[/quote]


Yes, lots of opinions, fewer ideas. One suggestion, cut down class size, get more teachers out of offices into classrooms, press for teacher proficiency. (I know one K'garten teacher who failed the 3rd grade math proficiency 3 times). Tell the administrators to let teachers teach; forget about the racial makeup and other irrelevant statistics. If a kid isn't learning, find out why not and correct the problem asap.

Don't cut out art, music, drama, or gym. But ask ourselves if we're getting the most out of the $$ spent for these courses. Students are almost blase about their artistic opportunities. Let them stand in line to use a kiln, or a good ensemble show instead of (shudder) Hamlet as the high school drama choice. (yes, I've heard that that's done...I don't ever want to see it!) Who in high school is ready for "Hello, Dolly?"

Less emphasis on sports is an easy thing to say, but harder to accomplish. We could start by making sure that athletes understand that their talents are God-given, not something they deserve as a birthright. Encourage them to promote a more socially democratic environment. Putting an arm around the shoulders of a nerd is a better idea than putting your hand around his neck. Administrators and some teachers have responsibility here, too. Classroom teachers may resent the power athletes have, but they too often kow-tow to it or tacitly allow the kids to misuse that power.

Ok, so I taught in the public schools. If you've read this far, that should be no surprise. Probably you didn't.

[Skerdog]

Oprah just did an expose' in Shelbyville, IN. (Don't focus on the fact that I was watching Oprah, focus on the next fact.)

Sorry I can't help it. Oprah ?!?!? Gah!

[tycstover]

Anyone have info, opinions, or stories to share about this?

Yes, lots of opinions, fewer ideas. One suggestion, cut down class size, get more teachers out of offices into classrooms, press for teacher proficiency. (I know one K'garten teacher who failed the 3rd grade math proficiency 3 times). Tell the administrators to let teachers teach; forget about the racial makeup and other irrelevant statistics. If a kid isn't learning, find out why not and correct the problem asap.

Don't cut out art, music, drama, or gym. But ask ourselves if we're getting the most out of the $$ spent for these courses. Students are almost blase about their artistic opportunities. Let them stand in line to use a kiln, or a good ensemble show instead of (shudder) Hamlet as the high school drama choice. (yes, I've heard that that's done...I don't ever want to see it!) Who in high school is ready for "Hello, Dolly?"

Less emphasis on sports is an easy thing to say, but harder to accomplish. We could start by making sure that athletes understand that their talents are God-given, not something they deserve as a birthright. Encourage them to promote a more socially democratic environment. Putting an arm around the shoulders of a nerd is a better idea than putting your hand around his neck. Administrators and some teachers have responsibility here, too. Classroom teachers may resent the power athletes have, but they too often kow-tow to it or tacitly allow the kids to misuse that power.

Ok, so I taught in the public schools. If you've read this far, that should be no surprise. Probably you didn't.

Amen...
Transformation is a journey not a destination.
The people that think we need to "do this... to get there".
Do not undertand the process of change.
And trying to go BACK to the 40s and 50s is obviously not working.
Asked to hear a kid read recently?
Until there is as much import placed on reading a book ALOUD or
being able to actually feel something when you look at a peice of
art or hear a peice of music and being able to catch a football this
problem will never be sloved.

We have children with no passion NO PASSION for ANYTHING.
They are leaving schools because
they can. Because they are being taught the same apathy at home.
And the schools are expected to correct that?? Give me a break.
Now, don't get me wrong I think there is a huge place for PHYSICAL
EDUCATION. That has basically been pitched out as well. Kids have
to take it in the summer in many cases to get the requirement they
need in. That is complete BS. You create FAT SOCIETIES...hellooooooo
we live in one, I am part of one. Fat boy here. If I had been TAUGHT
PHYSICAL EDUCATION in school and not PE by some idiot that was only
on faculty to coach football and wrestling and track. Then maybe I would
have been taught how to treat my body. But instead we (American Society) treat that
(and many other teaching positions need I mention social studies?)
like an all purpose dumping ground for people who's sole purpose to
be there is to coach sports. I know this is far from a popular stance but
people it is true. Look around you. We are one of the most over-weight
states in one of the most over-weight nations on the planet and our
kids are getting fatter and more stupid the further we go. WAAAAZZUP?
Now, I own my fattness. I do not blame any teacher or society or outside
force I made and make choices that have created this body in which I
reside. But, who is teaching kids that? (Don't even get me started on that
issue.)


I am trying to have a kid right now and I am scared as hell about what it will
be like when it is time for it to go to school. It makes me sad.

[agingdiva]

We have children with no passion NO PASSION for ANYTHING.

I am trying to have a kid right now and I am scared as hell about what it will
be like when it is time for it to go to school. It makes me sad.[/quote]

Maybe your passion will be transferred to the next generation, Ty. Little guys are passionate about learning. Keep the flame burning!

[Amphitryon38]

Oprah says that Shelbyville has a 1 in 3 dropout rate in High Schools. She also says that High Schools all over IN are being called "drop out factories."

Anyone have info, opinions, or stories to share about this?

I think Oprah speaks the truth. I know this is a big problem in Marion County (Thanks to an expose by the Indianapolis Star).

I don't know about the teaching, but I do agree that we should drop high school drama to a "teen" level. I'm not trying to be condescending, but there are some excellent pieces that do what theatre shoud and challenge the actors where they are in life.

I get tired of seeing productions of "You Can't Take It with You" at the high school level. Great show, but it's hard for a 17-year-old to play Grandpa. Plus there are some really wonderful shows written about and for teen-agers.

My soapbox, sorry.

Gus

[tycstover]

NO NO NO Gus...
We CAN"T do that!!
Those shows MIGHT actually deal with some issues that kids actually HAVE
to deal with. And God forbid that the be faced with that!!

I was hired this spring to teach a playwrighting workshop and a highschool
that will remain namless. The kids wrote an amazing piece. Insiteful, well
put together, thanks to awesome instuction if I do say so myself.

And the administation was so afraid of what "people would say" and "besides
we are hoping to start a building program next year" that they refused to
let the kids perform the play....couldn't even do an invited reading of the
show. So, of course the teacher stood behind the kids and fought for
the integrity of the art, right. Just like RAGTIME down south of town, right?
Nope, becuase he has fear of keeping his position he had to give in to the
admin's whims. Sad. So, not wonder they sitck to the safe stuff. I understand
first hand why they do.
T

[actress4200]

Oh, so many issues, so little time to type.....

1. Parents. It all starts at home. The most incredible teachers in the world cannot conquer bad parents. And bad parents come in so many forms from the "my kid is always right" to the "do I have a kid" to "why should they get an education, I didn't and look at me" etc. etc. etc. etc. Teachers may fight a good fight at times, and I wish them well. They should keep trying, but one does get tired of the battle. I have so many examples of this I could rant on my soapbox for hours, but I'll refrain.

2. Teachers & the school system in general. They are overworked and underpaid and they get no support from the parents or the administration. My son was struggling in math. We asked for a parent/teacher conference. The counselor and assistant principal came to sit-in on the meeting (why? who knows?). The teacher came in ready to defend herself (probably against the other 2 staffers) and stated "she didn't understand what we were worried about. He had a C- in the class." The end result is that we had to teach him at home all year because he wasn't going to be expected to do better than the minimum standards.

Now are all teachers like that? The sad answer is probably yes and if they aren't now they probably will be beaten down to that level in time because the hurdles they have to jump are just too darn high. I come from a long line of teachers and I've seen the deterioration in the system and it finally gets to even the best of the best.

3. Arts vs. sports. Sports will always be with us and if all children were encouraged to participate vs. just the "stars" I wouldn't have a problem whatsoever. Physical activity and team work are worthy goals. Arts? Arts in school? Sorry - no time, no funding. Don't raise our taxes. Don't invest in our future. Let's stick to those minimum standards. Don't dream. Don't demand more. I read an article written by a school board member that said they couldn't raise the taxes because only 20% of the residents of a community had children in the school system. I nearly choked. Since when did public education have to be solely funded by citizens who have students in the system? Isn't that why we call it public education? Don't we as a society benefit from well educated children who then grow up and take over our businesses and art run our governments?

I'm out of time and have to go to work. My final question is who is ultimately to blame for our problems? WE ARE. Everyone who doesn't work to start changing our system. It will affect us all eventually - current parents, future parents, and those who never plan to be parents. If an Oprah expose will give us the kick in the pants that we need to start doing something about it, then go Oprah.

[Eric_Bryant]

This is such an excellent topic of discussion, and some terrific points have been brought out already.

Thank you, actress4200, for noting parental responsibility first. My sister has been a teacher for about 30 years, my sister-in-law is a teacher, and I have other teachers in my extended family and circle of friends. Their number one complaint? Parents. Interestingly, parents on the two extremes. Worst group are the parents who are not involved in the least and expect the teachers to babysit the kids. Second worst group are the parents who closely monitor their kid's grades, but don't take responsibility for actually working with their own kids when the grades start to slip. Instead, they barrage the teachers and administration with phone calls, emails and requests for meetings for the sole purpose of blaming the schools for little Johnny or little Sally's failings, but would never, ever ask, "So, what can I be doing at home to help?"

There's nothing wrong with athletic programs (this from someone who couldn't get on the Hopscotch team) as long as the focus is on teamwork, setting goals, physical education, nutrition and learning how to lose with grace. Besides, the athletic programs tend to bring money into the schools, more so than the drama programs. Now we need to find funding to bring the arts (music, theater, fine arts, etc.) back into the schools as they also teach valuable skills like teamwork, setting goals, learning to lose with grace, math skills and even physical education and nutrition.

[GaryWood]

1. Parents. It all starts at home.

Don't have time to read all this....but don't need to. The statement above is really the only one that matters. "Teach your children well...."

If you raise your children and don't expect the teacher, the policman, the judge, the football player, or the pop star to do it, everything else will fall in line. And when your child fails, don't look to someone else for blame. The failure of the the child is the failure of the parent.

I can't even CONCIEVE of ANY circumstance where my child would drop out of school.

Parenting....Just Do It.